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William Administrator


Joined: 10 Apr 2006 Posts: 4056 Location: Scotland
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Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:01 pm Post subject: The Age Matters Debate - Great Things Take Time |
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Quick fix culture is losing its lustre and even fast turnaround commodities can depend on time and experience to succeed. This was the conclusion reached at a prestigious 'The Age Matters Debate', led by award winning historian Bettany Hughes and cultural commentator Peter Aspden, at London's Victoria and Albert Museum
'The Age Matters Debate' took place to coincide with the unveiling of a new global education campaign from Chivas Brothers, 'Great Things Take Time' aimed at informing consumers about the true value of high aged Scotch whiskies.
Chivas Brothers aims to bridge this knowledge gap in a campaign entitled "Great Things Take Time' to help us understand the value of what we're buying.
More here:
www.scotchmaltwhisky.co.uk/agematters-greatthingstaketime.htm _________________ There's no bad whisky. Just good whisky and better whisky. |
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Brummie Master Of Malts

Joined: 08 Feb 2010 Posts: 661
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Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| There are a few whisky companies taking advantage of the "Quick fix culture" by moving to no age statement whiskies to make a quick profit. |
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chrisg Double Malt Member

Joined: 12 Apr 2011 Posts: 197
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Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Brummie, would you be referring to The Macallan by any chance. |
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Big Mac Master Of Malts

Joined: 02 Nov 2006 Posts: 2216 Location: USA - Formerly Scotland
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Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:34 am Post subject: |
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| chrisg wrote: | | Brummie, would you be referring to The Macallan by any chance. | I think he may be referring to the Macallan.
Well done to Chivas for carrying on the Age Matters campaign. |
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Fergie Master Of Malts

Joined: 02 Dec 2006 Posts: 1743
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Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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| I have to say i am all for the Chivas Age Matters campaign, i wasnt at first as i thought it doesnt matter to taste as young whisky can be just as interesting and enjoyable as the more aged stuff but given the way whisky prices are going i would say it does matter very much to the price. |
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Alexppp Master Of Malts

Joined: 16 Jul 2010 Posts: 1791
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Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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There seems to be a paradox here - the campaign shows that most buyers would be willing to pay a premium for older whiskies, and even associate age statements with quality.
Yet on the other hand Macallan are getting rid of age statements altogether and hiking the prices up, and experience an increase in profits at the same time. |
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Quaich1 Master Of Malts


Joined: 21 Apr 2012 Posts: 5749 Location: Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Alexppp wrote: | There seems to be a paradox here - the campaign shows that most buyers would be willing to pay a premium for older whiskies, and even associate age statements with quality.
Yet on the other hand Macallan are getting rid of age statements altogether and hiking the prices up, and experience an increase in profits at the same time. |
That's a very good point Alex! It's like having one's cake and eating it too. _________________ "Always carry a large flagon of whisky in case of snakebite and furthermore always carry a small snake."
W.C. Fields (1880-1946) |
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Archer Master Of Malts

Joined: 06 Oct 2009 Posts: 1520
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Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Quaich1 wrote: | | Alexppp wrote: | There seems to be a paradox here - the campaign shows that most buyers would be willing to pay a premium for older whiskies, and even associate age statements with quality.
Yet on the other hand Macallan are getting rid of age statements altogether and hiking the prices up, and experience an increase in profits at the same time. |
That's a very good point Alex! It's like having one's cake and eating it too. | Macallan have only done this in duty free so far, i wonder if they will have the same success replacing age statement whisky for no age statement whisky in the domestic market.
Macallan are promoting/marketing there whisky as premium whisky and asking premium prices for there whisky and they do this very well indeed. IMO there packaging of there duty free range does imply quality premium whisky and the casual non-regular malt whisky buyer passing through airport shops will see it as such. There Macallan Select Oak entry level whisky in the duty free range is around £45 which i suspected was around 10 years old and there Macallan Whisky Makers Edition is over £60 which i suspect is around 12 years old.The Macallan Whisky Makers Edition is an excellent dram but is the price tag justified if as what i suspect it is around 12 years old.
Macallan have recently repositioned the domestic market Macallan 18 in there price range by massively increasing the price to £100 and i would guess they will slot in some of the new soon to come younger no age statement whisky into the price position the 18 year held. If they have nothing to hide they could tell us the age or at the very least the age range of the whisky in each bottling. For example the Glenfiddich released the Snow Phoenix and told us it contained whisky aged from 13 year up to 30 years old.
Chivas/Glenlivet are trying to educate buyers about the significance of age/quality and of course that the older the whisky the bigger the price tag, of course they are also trying to protect there share of the older premium whisky market which they effectively control. |
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Alexppp Master Of Malts

Joined: 16 Jul 2010 Posts: 1791
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Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Some good points there. Of course Chivas/Glenlivet also have profits as their top priority, it's just that Macallan seem disingenuous by comparison. As you said it will be interesting to see how their range will fare once they switch to no age statements in the domestic market. I'm sure the quality of the whisky is still excellent but I wouldn't pay unfair prices to find out. |
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bifter Master Of Malts

Joined: 10 Apr 2012 Posts: 1403 Location: East Lothian
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Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:33 am Post subject: |
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My opinion of course but, although I agree in principle, age doesn't necessarily make a great whisky - a poor cask or spirit (or cut of spirit) or too much time in a cask can result in an expensive yet substandard product. Of the older whiskies I have tried (up to 40yo) some may even have suffered from the length of their time in the cask, particularly in relation to their price which of course increasingly (exponentially?) reflects the exclusivity more than the quality. Conversely amazing things can be achieved with very young spirit though I find this particularly to be the case with peated whisky (Ardbeg, Octomore, Longrow, etc), which might lead to some interesting, even controversial, conclusions. It is a skill indeed to identify whiskies when, all things considered, they are as good as they are going to get and perhaps this is truly what 'matters' rather than age itself?
As much as it pains me I might also concede that I don't have a particularly refined nose or palate though I have managed to improve both over the years and I intend to continue doing so. However, although certain elements, e.g. rancio, only emerge after many years I find that improvements in balance or integration beyond, say, 20 years become increasingly hard to discern. For me these whiskies are usually simply different rather than being 'better' though perhaps true connoisseurs would beg to differ. Or perhaps I haven't tried the right whiskies and I haven't had my epiphany just yet. _________________ "Whisky is liquid sunshine."
[George Bernard Shaw] |
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Alexppp Master Of Malts

Joined: 16 Jul 2010 Posts: 1791
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Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:39 am Post subject: |
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| bifter wrote: | | My opinion of course but, although I agree in principle, age doesn't necessarily make a great whisky - a poor cask or spirit (or cut of spirit) or too much time in a cask can result in an expensive yet substandard product. Of the older whiskies I have tried (up to 40yo) some may even have suffered from the length of their time in the cask, particularly in relation to their price which of course increasingly (exponentially?) reflects the exclusivity more than the quality. Conversely amazing things can be achieved with very young spirit though I find this particularly to be the case with peated whisky (Ardbeg, Octomore, Longrow, etc) |
Agreed - some of my favourite whiskies are no-age statements (Laphroaig QC, Talisker 57 North, Aberlour a'bunadh...), but the key is that they're reasonably priced of course, unlike the way Macallan are heading... |
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